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Natrix maura or tesselata???: |
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-LAF Senior Member Joined: 03 Apr 2003 No. of posts: 317  View other posts by -LAF |
Posted: 26 Apr 2005 Hi guys, I was wondering if anyone out there knew of a sure fire way of telling Natrix maura from Natrix tesselata from a side-on head photograph. I'm affraid I can't post the picture as it isn't mine but it is of extreme interest to me as it one of these snakes and (I beleive the latter but want to be sure) and was taken on a part of the old Thorne-Moor complex, the same complex that included Holme-upon-Spalding moor, which was known to have had N. tesselata introduced there in the 1970s. I'm making efforts to contact the photographer to get a date and confirmation but I don't beleive the image to be fake as he miss-identified it. Any good advice (which upper labials enter the eye etc) would be mucho appreciated. Lee Lee Fairclough |
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Caleb Forum Coordinator Joined: 17 Feb 2003 No. of posts: 448 View other posts by Caleb |
Posted: 27 Apr 2005 I was told years ago that the number of preoculars and postoculars is a reasonable way to distinguish the 3 European species. Boulenger's 'Snakes of Europe', (available for free at http://www.herper.com/ebooks/titles/Europesnakes.html, pdf, approx 2MB) says: N.n. 1 pre, 3 post N.t. 2 pre, 3 post N.m. 1 or 2 pre, 2 post. |
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-LAF Senior Member Joined: 03 Apr 2003 No. of posts: 317 View other posts by -LAF |
Posted: 27 Apr 2005 Cheers Caleb. I totally forgot about using that book, it's excellent for morphology. That should do the trick nicely! Many thanks. Regards, Lee. Lee Fairclough |
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-LAF Senior Member Joined: 03 Apr 2003 No. of posts: 317 View other posts by -LAF |
Posted: 27 Apr 2005 Right. The snake in question in Natrix maura. I now have an strong suspicion that this is not the first picture of such a snake from this site tha I have encountered. The other image was an 'adder' photographed on this site, feigning death... odd adder behaviour, very natrix. Need to get a second look now. Thanks for the help. Lee. Lee Fairclough |
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Vicar Senior Member Joined: 02 Sep 2004 No. of posts: 1181 View other posts by Vicar |
Posted: 30 Apr 2005 Just added to assist confirmation: {A Field Guide to the Reptiles and Amphibians of Britain and Europe, Arnold & Burton, 0 00 219318 3 - Excellent book imo !}
Steve Langham - Chairman 
Surrey Amphibian & Reptile Group (SARG). |
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-LAF Senior Member Joined: 03 Apr 2003 No. of posts: 317 View other posts by -LAF |
Posted: 30 Apr 2005 Thanks for that Steve. Both my copies of this book are with other people so wasn't able to check. I've enclosed a link to one of the two photo's below: Photo Pretty sure it's N. maura. Will come back to the site details when I've spoken to the photographer. Hopefully second photo from the site to follow soon. Regards, Lee. Lee Fairclough |
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Jeroen Senior Member Joined: 03 Nov 2004 No. of posts: 121  View other posts by Jeroen |
Posted: 30 Apr 2005 Hi Lee, for what it's worth - I agree with the ID. The dice snakes I have seen never had such obvious markings on the flanks and the zigzag is (still) visible quite well. Jeroen Speybroeck http://www.hylawerkgroep.be/jeroen/ |
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Wolfgang Wuster Senior Member Joined: 23 Apr 2003 No. of posts: 326 View other posts by Wolfgang Wuster |
Posted: 30 Apr 2005 Yep, that is definitely N. maura. As far as I can make out, it has two postocs, and I would say that supralabs 3 and 4 enter the eye. Also, apart from the pattern characters mentioned by Jeroen, N. tesellata normally has a more or less uniform top of the head, whereas N. maura has a distinct head pattern, which is visible on that photo. Cheers, Wolfgang Wolfgang Wüster School of Biological Sciences, University of Wales, Bangor http://sbsweb.bangor.ac.uk/~bss166/ |
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Dan Kane Senior Member Joined: 30 Dec 2005 No. of posts: 201  View other posts by Dan Kane |
Posted: 30 Dec 2005 Yes, I agree with Wolfgang. Its a Natrix maura because of the dark spots on the flanks and because of the viper-like zigzag along the back, typical of N. maura. Dice Snakes normally have a uniform light brown head, whilst Viperine Snakes often have darker markings on the head. Dan www.randacumbria.moonfruit.com |
- Natrix maura or tesselata??? |
